Good Girl vs. Bad Girl

1
Good Girl vs. Bad Girl Tough Guy vs. Sweet Guy
Perceptions of Young People on How Traditional
Gender Roles Still Affect Relationship Choices
and Pleasure

• Research carried out by Betsy Crane Kathryn
  Thompson, Indiana University of Pennsylvania,
  Jesse Crane-Seeber, American University
• Presented by Betsy Crane at SSSS Western Region
  Conference, Redondo Beach, CA, April 8, 2006
  bcrane_at_iup.edu

2
Purpose of research

• Qualitative study of perceptions of young people
  in their early-mid 20s related to traditional
  non-traditional gender roles, sexual identities,
  relationships, pleasure.
• In what ways do constructs such as the good
  girl and tough guy have meaning in their lives
  relationships?
• How do these roles and identities constrain or
  define gendered sexual identities experiences?

3
Gender/Sexual identity

• Gender as social construct as performance
  (Butler, 1993
• Gender sexual identities under flux exist on
  continuum. Young people are pioneers.
  (Savin-Williams, 2005)
• Nuances of patriarchal domination feminist study
  of masculinities (e.g. Connell, 1995)
• Multicultural matrices of domination (Hill
  Collins, 1990)
• Gender may be fragmenting but it still permeates
  the structure of social order (Lorbeer, 2005, p.
  xii).

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Four Boxes of Gendered Sexuality (Crane
Crane-Seeber, 2003)
Good Girl Wife/Mother

• Bad Girl
• Whore/Dyke

• Sweet Guy
• Fag/Sissy

Tough Guy Protector/Dominator
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Heritage of 6,000 year history

• Male social and political domination led to norms
  based on
• Acceptance of the social order by males females
• Dominating social sexual behavior by males
• Repression of females, the feminine,
  homosexuality.
• Disciplining of masculinity

6
Expectations for women and men

• Tug and pull between security/ social
  acceptability vs. personal authenticity.
• Heteronormativity - Marriage and roles of wife
  and husband still carry heavy symbolic weight.
• Legacy of traditional gender roles affects daily
  life, people in same and other-gender
  relationships.

7
Student-led focus group discussions

• Focus group discussions led by Thompson,
  undergraduate psychology student at IUP,
  Crane-Seeber, IR doctoral student at American
  University.
• Thus far (ongoing project) three groups with 14
  participants 2 participant-researchers
• 2 groups at a college in rural western
  Pennsylvania, 1 group in Washington, DC.

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Purposeful sampling

• Information-rich cases
• Young people who were familiar with this theory,
  having heard class presentation and/or read
  article sophisticated about gender/sexuality.
• Ages 20-28 median age 23
• Ethnicity white/European heritage additional
  data collection will include other
  races/ethnicities

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Context and Sample

• 2/3 focus groups in western PA No nudity in
  womens sauna very Christian, but
  hook-ups/casual sex becoming more common.
• Voluntary sample of those who had taken Sociology
  of Sexuality class or read article relatively
  sophisticated about sexuality and gender theory.
• As one said I think that the ways in which the
  social guidelines tell us the way that we should
  be, and should not be, with gender and with
  sexuality, are incredibly mind-boggling.

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Demographics/Open-coding

• Gender identity Female (8) Queer (1) Neutral
  (1) Male (4)
• Sexual identity Hetero/straight (2) Hetero,
  open, bi-curious (3) Queer (4) Lesbian or gay
  (2) Bi-sexual (2)
• Socio-Economic Class Raised poor or working
  class (4) lower middle class (3) middle class
  (5) upper class (1)

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Inductive findings

• Fluidity around gender/sexual identity.
• Awareness of resistance to traditional
  expectations and heterosexual imperative. For
  those in same-sex relationships, traditional
  roles are a backdrop, but are making it up as we
  go along.
• Males feeling more confined by traditional roles
  less support for change.
• Women - 3rd-wavy, post-modern feminists still
  oriented toward the protector-dominator tough
  guys.
• May have sex with tough guys, but dont trust
  them Difficulty initiating sex with sweet guys.
• May not trust the sweet guys see them as
  reverting to tough guy.
• Another thinks sweet guys are really sexy.

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Gender/Sexual Identities Flexible Categories

• M -I sort of jump back forth between perceived
  genders.
• F- As far as gender, I have such a mixture of
  traditionally feminine and masculine traits that
  I dont even bother trying to identify them
  anymore. I only identify with people who also
  seem to have that mix.
• F- I hate labels. Id rather be curvy than
  straight any day.

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• M - I try to, especially around males that I
  dont know, I try to put onI do the tough guy
  thing. I compete with other males, and I work on
  muscles, I play aggressive sports, and I like to
  win arguments. Im sort of a dominant
  personality, in that case.
• But when it really comes down to it, Im more of
  a sweet guy or a nice guy. So depending on who I
  interact with, I display either of those roles.

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• F -I definitely identify my gender as queer,
  because I feel like I can dress in a t-shirt and
  khaki pants and cargo pants and boy tennis shoes.
  I think the only article of clothing I have to
  buy in the female section at this point that Im
  wearing is my bra. Cause they just dont make
  good male bras, yknow?
• F Ive always been very feminine, I never went
  through the tomboy phase. It was very hard for me
  when I was getting older, because my parents just
  said Dont have sex until youre married, its
  bad, la la la. And so I didnt know how to
  handle myself.

15

• M -I identify as a man, but I guess if it would
  fit into boxes Id be more of a female. I can
  relate more, I can talk more to girls about
  cosmetics and appearance than guys. As for
  sexuality, Im just a sexual person who has an
  attraction more towards females. But, I mean,
  Ive never ruled out a man, I just havent found
  one.
• M - Tell me about it. Ive just been attracted to
  females, but Im not going to turn down a man, if
  I like him. Thats pretty much where I see
  myselfnot as gay, not as straight, as bisexual
  but just attracted to people.

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Sexual Identity

• F -I identify as a woman, a sexual woman
  bisexual is too limiting.
• F -I used to identify as lesbian but now Im
  just queer even lesbian is too constricting.
  There might be a some cool feminist guys out
  there that might be alright to be with.

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Being queer- not having to specify

• F- I would identify as queer because its like
  too much pressure to try to figure everything
  out. You know what I mean? Like I dont really
  know, because I think Im gay but sometimes I
  like guys. Its like way too much pressure, so I
  just like queer, because then it doesnt matter,
  whatever happens is fine. Thats really nice to
  know.
• And mostly I find Im attracted to people who
  are ambiguously gendered anyway, which makes that
  even weirder to try to figure out because Im
  like, well I like boys, but only boys that are
  really girly (laughter) and so its really hard
  to figure out. I think queer is just good.

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Queer multiple meanings

• F- I just think that queer isits a good word
  for being able to do whatever you like and having
  the mobility to do whatever you like.
• F- When I came out, queer theory was not
  something I had even heard of, and its so
  encompassing now, all-encompassing, just
  everything that you want to be thats not
  traditionally heterosexual. Thats something that
  even I havent gotten into myself, to identify
  myself as queer because I do identify myself as,
  Yeah, Im gay, Im queer. But I dont like
  malesI just dont. I dont want really anything
  to do with them. I mean, yeah, I like talking
  with my friendsI dont hate males, its just

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Perceptions of changes

• F Its more expected now for women to have
  careers, and to be sexual. Although I see theres
  still a lot of double standards, women being
  called whores, but thats another issue.
• M It seems like men are starting to be allowed
  to express their sexuality more. When I say
  express their sexuality more, I mean be honest
  with it, and authentic. Like, theyre allowed to
  wear tighter, more revealing clothing.

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Greater acceptance of gay/queer

• F- People are starting to become more aware of it
  - programs in schools and conferences and
  everything supporting gay rights, queer rights. I
  do think it is getting better.
• M - As society becomes more open to itwell, not
  necessarily ours, but the world society as a
  whole, then more and more people will have
  experience with it and theyll realize that its
  not the social other that weve been fed all of
  our lives. Its so refreshing once you can see
  people come to that. It really is.

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Perceptions of changes, cont.

• F -Things are getting better in that people are
  coming out and being themselves, which opens the
  road for other people to be like Okay, maybe I
  can come out and be myself.
• But I feel that our social institutions,
  especially the media, are just pushing hetero
  hetero hetero - stay in your boxes, and if you
  dont, were just gonna hate you.

22
Perception of Backlash

• F- I think that things are on the upswing, but
  Im thinking there is a big backlash now because
  its such a a cultural change going on, in this
  country anywaywhere people are all of a sudden
  becoming less tolerant, and theyre trying to
  pass laws to prevent (gay marriage).

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Traditional norms/expectations

• F This is coming from growing up in a very
  religious household, but not necessarily living
  that lifestyle. And also from my peers and the
  world in general. Women are still looked atthe
  women in the bad girl category are still looked
  upon as whores, even with all the changes women
  are experiencingI have lots of male friends,
  especially from when I was growing up, I had a
  lot of male friends, and just the way they talk
  about women, women they see at bars, its like
  Oh yeah, shes a slut, I cant even think of
  some of the words they used.

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• F- So many people who I consider to be educated,
  open minded, empowered, and thensomething will
  occur, and they just totally go immediately to an
  essentialist perspective, oh Boys will be boys.
  What the hell does that mean? Boys will be
  What? Bullies? Boys will be mean? Theyll beat
  up on other guys.
• M Theyll be rapists.

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Heteronormative expectations

• F- I recently told my mother that I was bisexual
  on Easteryou know, you say it with the ham, and
  its good. And she freaked out, and I told her,
  Well, you do realize this means I still like
  men, and shes like Oh, good. Like it was
  calming her...cause she was picturing my future
  and getting married and having kids and all of
  that, she was seeing that whole line laid out in
  front of me and all of a sudden I just like cut
  the line, and she freaked out.

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• F- A lot of people that I know, even people that
  consider themselves pretty open in many different
  ways, still aspire to get married with one
  person, buy a townhouse, and settle down and live
  that lifestyle forever. I definitely think that
  our traditional gender roles still very much
  affect a lot of what we do.
• But for myself, now that Ive been more
  interested in this issue, I consciously try to
  break down those gender stereotypes, where I can.
  Just sort of not think about how I need to act
  because Im a woman, but rather just try to think
  of how I ought to act based on what I want to do
  and who I am.

27

• F I think a lot of young women are hesitant to
  initiate sex, especially in a straight
  relationship. And I can certainly say that from
  my own experience. I felt that at age 20 I would
  be empowered enough not to be that way, but I
  think if Im honest about myself its something
  that consciously, initially, I wasnt aware of,
  but it still happens.

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Effects of traditional roles

• F Girls are encouraged more to be independent,
  but its at a price. If you are independent, then
  youre not going to get boys to like you, at all,
  ever. I mean, youre not going to get the
  traditional role guys to like you, which, there
  are lots of guys like that out there.
• Thats really hard, because girls are encouraged
  to go out and be their own people and have
  confidence and do all this stuff, but then in the
  end, if they do that, they also feel this need to
  have boyfriends, and then they cant, because
  they cant find guys that will like them when
  theyre being really independent.

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Heterosexual imperative as trap limit

• F- So I have to find a man, get married, have
  kids in one word, straight. It just feels
  like my whole life is dictated from here on out
  for the next 50 years and if I dont follow all
  the rules, all the proper steps, then Im not
  really straight anyway, so I just go ahead and
  skip the label, then I dont have to have all
  that pressure.

30

• F -A lot of times, girls are dating those
  assholes, not even because they are attracted to
  them. I think they feel like thats what they are
  supposed to do.
• M I definitely started to date way before I
  was ready for it, and never had a real
  relationship until college. It was just because
  thats what I thought I was supposed to do.

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Effects on F-M relationships

• F- Im oriented towards men, but its really
  hard for me to find a guy I can relate to because
  I think that more guys are in the boxes than
  girls, and I just cant stand people that dont
  have both feminine and masculine traits.
• F- I wonder to myself whether my fear of being
  in relationships, other than my fear of being
  hurt personally, was also related to the fact
  that a lot of guys I knew were trying to be tough
  guys. And thats not at all what I wanted. It was
  hard to find sweet guys, because often they
  wouldnt be as aggressive as tough guys. And they
  wouldnt approach me, and I was dealing with my
  own sort of Well, Im supposed to be a good
  girl, so I shouldnt be initiating too much, or
  being too aggressive.

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Females - More flexible gender roles/performance.

• F - I think theres a lot more room for women to
  do whatever their little heart desires, around
  gender, than there is for men. Women arent as
  important. Masculinity- what it is to be male -
  is so crucial, that if you step out of it a
  little bit you are labeled. I really feel like
  theres a lot more life-threatening consequences
  for stepping outside of the whats socially
  proscribed to be a man than there are for being a
  female.

33
Being girly

• Gender-wisein a lot of ways Im traditionally
  feminine, like I dress really girly and I like to
  do crafts and knit and crochet. I dont like to
  do those things because theyre traditionally
  feminine, like a lot of girls who get into those
  things, but I feel like theres sort of like all
  these girls that are reclaiming really girly
  things in a cool kind of not-really-feminine way
  thats more how I do it. Even that I choose to
  dress really feminine nowI havent always, and
  it wasnt like I was taught to dress really
  feminine, but as I grew up I was like I really
  like skirts, theyre the best thing to wear ever,
  theyre so comfortable. I like bright colors,
  and so thats how I got into that, not
  necessarily because it was what I was supposed to
  do. So I guess I ended up kind of girly, but not
  because I have to be real traditional and there
  are lots of other things about me that I like
  that are not really feminine at all.

34

• M A counter-movement thats going on, thats
  pushing against gender freedom. From what I see
  on campus? Yeah. I live juxtaposed to frat row so
  I see the entire hyper masculine lifestyle that
  goes on, the whole gotta do a kegstand, and get
  as drunk as I can, and then I gotta see how many
  of these girls I can drag up to my room before
  theyre all gone, kind of an idea.
• I think thats getting more and more restrictive
  for people. In some cases. I think its going off
  in both directions, its becoming a dichotomy.
  Its either completely restrictive or completely
  free, I guess... Because I can either get one of
  those What are you? kind of looks from walking
  around in my normal clothes and my hair down, or
  I can get sort of Im glad youre here,
  reactions. I dont see much of a middle ground.
• As far as the masculine roles, the concept of
  masculine rolesI do think that were losing
  middle ground, and were going towards extremes.

35
Pleasure Gendered challenges

• F-Its exceedingly difficult for males to
  experience pleasure emotionally, whereas
  physically its almost automatic, in the
  biological sense.
• And for females, we are supposed to focus on the
  emotional aspects, feel connected and intimate
  with our partner, or forget about an orgasm once
  every six months and youre having sex every day.
• If you have the typical, hegemonically masculine
  male, the one whos just there for the sex and
  for the orgasmI think its detrimental to both
  parties its not fair to women and its not fair
  to men. Until you look at it holistically - as an
  intimacy and a mutual pleasure kind of thing -
  nobodys really going to be happy.

36

• F- I personally dont really believe that you
  can have a truly profoundly pleasurable sexual
  experience unless you are really okay with who
  you are and youre really connecting with another
  person that you can really connect with. So that
  becomes essential, because if both of you are
  just trying to put on this character all the
  time, and trying to make that go together, its
  never going to work out. Its never really going
  to be that great.

37

• F (cont.) I have a pretty sad view of mens
  pleasure I think a lot of times men must have
  bad sex a lot, all the time, always, because they
  cant feel anything, and they cant really feel
  pleasure. I just imagine, it must be terrible.
• M- And not being allowed to cry.
• F- And not being able to know, even know how to
  even begin to approach pleasure, to understand
  how it feels to be touched.

38

• F And not allowed to truly connect with their
  partners. Its something that Ive experienced,
  and Im like, Oh my God, are you HERE? What the
  hell? Were trying to be close here, and you
  seem like youre off in some far-distant land.
• Its so sad, and I think that the tough guy is
  sort of what makes that happen that men feel
  like they cant be connected to their bodies.
  They feel like they have to be removed and they
  cant show emotion. How is pleasure ever going to
  happen if you cant be in touch with yourself in
  any way?
• M It doesnt. Until you can give all that
  bullshit up, it doesnt.

39

• F- I think obviously theres a degree of that
  with women, too, but I think women are told more
  to be in touch with themselves, and their
  sensuality. To some extent, though, because we
  are allowed to
• F - Women are allowed to be more sensual. Men
  cant even enjoy sex. Women at least are allowed
  to enjoy kissing and caressing and things like
  that.
• M - Have you ever touched a boys nipples? They
  freak out. But its such a sensual part of the
  body, and my Godyou should.oh, wow. I dont
  know what to say. (lots of laughing).

40
Differences with women

• F- A lot of that is based on male-female sex. (In
  lesbian sex) orgasms happen all the time. Its
  not just the male getting off, and being like
  See you later, Im done! Thats just not how it
  is. For females sleeping with females, the
  pleasure is definitely something, to me at least,
  that can be heightened for both partners. They
  both can have multiple orgasmsor whoever may be
  participating. I think that its completely
  different.
• F - I love being with women, because Im there,
  here, on their emotional level. Ive never really
  found that with a guy. I dont know if its just
  me, because theyre not in touch with their
  emotions, but thats what it is. I love women for
  the emotionality and that brings me pleasure.
• M - Even as a teenager, experimenting with other
  guys, it wasnt satisfying because of that it
  was youre just this cute little boy that Im
  going to try to talk into bed and thats it.
  There isnt a sense of mutuality at all.

41

• F I think what is pleasureful, whats
  desirable - its the sharing of the power, or the
  absence of the power, totally. I feel like Im
  more attracted to women, on a Kinsey scale but
  the characteristics of people that I find
  pleasureful and the things that I desire are not
  strictly female. I just happen to either find
  them in women more because of the ways in which
  women are allowed to be more flexible, or Im not
  in the right town to find enough sweet guys.

42
Male not about balance of power

• M- Its so funny to listen to you, because
  youre so much into power, and Im not at all.
  Its so neat to hear that perspective. I think as
  far as pleasure, I think of comfort. I dont
  think so much of balance of power, I just think
  of what people provide its beyond
  characteristics, its beyond what realm of
  knowledge someone is familiar with. Its
  justbalance. And feeling comfortable with that
  balance.

43
Relational Social Constructionism

• These data suggest that gender/sexual identity
  isnt about biology or essence its produced
  through culturally mediated interactions with
  others.
• Illustrate how those in dissident or marginalized
  communities see themselves in relation to
  normative expectations
• Self-other differentiation, binaries, membership
  categories

44
Self-Other Differentiation

• F (the Christian right). On one hand, I feel
  sorry for them, that theyre a dying breed, but I
  also feel terribly overcome with anxiety about my
  generation. I feel troubled about our generation.
  I feel like its a strong part of the
  counter-movement is our generation, the kids our
  age.

45
Boundary practice

• F- I cant standthe dominator/protector, the
  beer and tits guys. Guys with that mentality. I
  just cant stand to be around them. I dont want
  to see them. I stereotype them based on looks and
  everything. I try to find a person to have
  relationship with that doesnt fit into either of
  the boxes. But its hard. I meet a lot more girls
  who dont fit into the boxes than I do guys.

46
See tug and pull of old patterns

• F- I think there needs to be a disclaimer -
  because you can have that connection with
  someone, have a really incredible experience, and
  be with them physically, emotionally, mentally,
  all at the same time, and then still, because of
  whatever, because of their frame of mind, because
  of how they grew up, because of the boxes,
  because of labels and stereotypes, a month later
  they turn out to be just like everyone else
  youve met. And all of a sudden, theyre not
  there emotionally, mentally, physically, at all.

47
Relation to normative expectations

• M- I know Im not part of the norm, but am
  affected by the norm, and trying to understand
  that Slightly enlightened, critically thinking.
• Still heavily influenced by male stereotypes and
  rebelling against many of those while still
  looking to identify where they live and exist
  within me.

48
Directions for research

• Additional data collection more diversity in
  sample, ethnically and in terms of gender and
  sexual identities.
• Additional questions how do traditionally
  identified young people negotiate these
  identities?

49
References

• Butler, J. (1993). Bodies that matter On the
  discursive limits of sex. New York Rutledge.
• Connell, R. W. (1995). Masculinities. Berkeley
  University of California Press.
• Crane, B. Crane-Seeber, J. (2003). The four
  boxes of gendered sexuality Good girl/bad girl
  tough guy/sweet guy. In Heasley, R. Crane, B.
  (Ed.). Sexual lives A reader on the theories and
  realities of human sexualities, New York
  McGraw-Hill.
• Hill Collins, P. (1990). Black feminist thought
  Knowledge, consciousness the politics of
  empowerment. Boston Unwin Hymnan.
• Lorbeer, J. (2005). Breaking the bowls
  Degendering and feminist change. New York W.W.
  Norton Co.
• Savin-Williams, R. C. (2005). The new gay
  teenager. Cambridge, MA Harvard University
  Press.